one of the best things about the living room couch in my current house is that I can skulk in the corner and pretend I am not at home if I dont feel like answering the door, and I am literally impossible to see from outside the house. Then I realize theyre not going to punish me, they really were just asking, and its no big deal going forward. See Id totally get that we should do this! doesnt actually mean it until you make specific plans, but as soon as someone actually mentions a day Id assume its something that is almost certainly going to happen and we just need to confirm the time. She knows because she has been explicitly told so and reacted not by feeling embarrassed and trying to learn how to navigate social boundaries better but by punishing people for telling her until it becomes easier to just leave things alone. Looking back on it I can see my mother had some pretty serious anxiety issues that we kids had no clue about at the time, but the whole thing has had a lasting effect on me. Then, make a conscious decision to switch your focus elsewhere: on another new friend or date, on a hobby, on a great book youre reading, on showing up in some way for the people you already know and love. Even if the person talking about the fun thing is a close friend, I clarify whether Im wanted there, and I try to do so in a way that doesnt sound like Im angling for an invitation. Guys don't usually invite girl (friends) to hang out alone just to "hang out". I am so glad asking this question because its one Ive also had, although in my case Im on the other side of the fence Im friends with the mom, and her daughter likes my kids, but they cant stand her. Or better yet, they would drunk-call me at midnight screaming WHERE R U? It would be ridiculous to never mention my aunt to my cousin just in case she were upset that I ever did something with aunt that didnt include her. Yeah the idea of being judged for passing through and not stopping and diverting your route to go see someone every time? When I say Im going, Im not asking to be made to stay, I want to go freely (at this point Im thinking of my grandmother, wholl always start begging me to stay longer when Im just too tired already and having to negotiate my right to leave doesnt help). Ask if you can sober up at his place for some time. Ring the doorbell I'd say one isn't better than the others. If you really think you're a faster swimmer than me, you'll have to prove it. Company are the ones who cant, and therefore shouldnt show up early. Dont even start playing that game you wanted to play, or reading that book youre reading, because god forbid youre in the middle of something when someone arrives! You were learning. (I wish it werent so, but in my limited and purely personal experience arranging any kind of social ANYTHING may range from difficult to impossible for an NNT young person), It gets even more clusterf*cky when you throw custody and visitation agreements into the mix. I had to talk to my best friend gently about that. And if I get somewhere ridiculously early I will go walk around the block several times until Im actually expected, or go to a coffee shop or something. Its like, oh for gods sake, just knock on the fucking door at this point, its not like I can text you go away when youre standing AT MY DOOR. After years away from it, I think we were (at best) incompatible in certain ways. I didnt say your way forward was easy, mind. Yeah. I dont even know how to make polite noises. And if he invites you over or comes to keep you company, then you are a clear winner in this situation. You can also drop a simple text letting him know you are looking forward to seeing him, to casually confirm the date ahead of time to ensure the plans are still on. From my perspective, THEY were the rude ones, just dropping by and then lingering.forever. Lets see I have body pump at ten stop at the store home at noon, shower yeah how about one, one thirty? do not show up at 12:30. Im okay with that sort of conversation, yet its been my experience that most people are not. Not everyone does. Id say, just go ahead and ask. NONE OF THE REST OF YOU ARE INVITED. Or in the North, for heat-related reasons, and also only one of us should have to brave the cold and ice. Anything other than an enthusiastic yes is a no. Which is why I despise despise despise Google Hangouts, but thats a completely different story. What counts as nothing pressing? Maybe they want to go home and do a Netflix marathon or something. It takes a certain level of presumption about how close your friendship is to ask someone else to host you, so if youre not 99.9% sure that person would like you to invite yourself over, avoid inviting yourself over. In college I was in a very tight friend group with my roommate + two other students who lived two doors down from us in the same building. Bandaid-off time, I think: Hey, friend, lets go to brunch on Sunday, and this invitation is for only you. Its safer in any situation to assume a no unless you give me an explicit yes. It didnt occur to me that that was what I was doing, I was just excited, dont get to see her much, and the bike shop is close to her home. im just saying that i didnt invite you is not a reason, but i would rather go with my bestie is. Home vs. work,surprise! vs. planned, andyou inviting yourself vs. her inviting you,speak to escalating levels of intimacy. I can! Maybe they were being good guests, maybe they were grateful for a way to feel involved, maybe they thought they were bribing the GM to be kind on the next critical botch. Its not that hard not to bring occasions to which another person wasnt invited in front of them. The people I remain consistently close friends with for years are the type where we can ignore each other for two months and then pick up where we left off and have a good time, no hurt feelings. Oh Lord, yes! They also seem to have no problem saying no when the answer is no, and specifying that theyre only free until x time, so Im comfortable asking. Cocktail outings are one thing, because oh, Ill just pull up an extra chair is hard to argue with. (*) You know, nude dancing in the most Brazilian way has some interesting implications . That meant that dropping by was much too frequent. Thank you for this post! Ive known a lot of people who are fine with people just showing up and I know thats their thing and Im not trying to shame them and say its wrong (if anything, I envy them) but I just dont understand it! If someone asks what I am doing or was doing [at such and such a time] and the detailed answer is something fun without you. If I answer at all I say I had dinner plans with a friend how was your weekend? or I had a bunch of stuff going on- I am actually kind of glad to be back to work. But thats really about it. She ran into the same person a couple of weeks later and it turned out it was a dinner party, she was the sixth guest, they waited two hours for her and dinner was ruined. Its not a thing where assumptions will actually pay off. Brief excerpts (<250 words) may be shared with attribution & a link to the original post. People arguing to come over when I dont want them. If you want me there, PLEASE invite me directly so I dont have to worry about my mothers disapproval! [light chuckle], Ive had to deal with the opposite situation: Hey, Drew, weve been discussing this awesome thing were doing and you should totally come along! Me, inside: I would rather floss my teeth with copper wire. Me, outside: Oh, I hope you guys have a great time; I just cant.. Usually I like things planned out in advance and double or triple checked. This right here. Where I grew up there was an open door culture. You could as well find out what his favorite movie is and go on to rent or buy it and ask if you guys can watch it at his place. This discussion is squicking me out because it is introducing doubt where there doesnt need to be any. I know, but like I said up thread, Ive had a couple of friends in the past who would in fact regularly cancel that close to whatever-it-was, so I got in the habit for a while because I couldnt trust that plans were real. Mezzanines description is honest; its just setting an agreed-upon check-in point in advanceyou need to check in and see if I want you to leave after X time, at which point I will let you know how I feel. Those are really helpful sometimes, especially if a person doesnt always realize theyre starting to feel run down unless the topic comes up. Especially because Im a person who is constantly worried about if Im inconveniencing them or pressuring them. Ive drifted into the no stopping by my place unless plans were arranged in advance/there is an emergency field, and I think it was because when I was growing up, there was a family of relatives who would come over to our house, unannounced, sans invitation, CONSTANTLY. Without telling us?). Ahaha. And good luck finding a place to put your car if you want to do that in LA. Do something about the many, many piles of random crap and books and papers and and. I cringe looking back on friendships where I was getting soft nos for literally months and cheerfully failing to put them into context (Hmm, maybe this person who is always busy and never calls me back doesnt want to see me! Ask him directly why he doesn't want you to see his place. If you're a fun, interesting person, who gets along well with everyone who's coming, then nobody's really going to protest if you appear. And Ill send that message a week or two in advance. Ha, I grew up in a similar neighborhood culture- but in kind of a hippie community where there were few fences and a lot of windows. Finally I think he invited you because he might want to spend a few good times with you like watch a movie or maybe he wand to do the next step to kiss you or just tell you he likes you or something. As someone who *likes* being dropped in on, I still have certain caveats: ME: Oh! All the needs to happen after that is showing up, right? I dont like surprises so thats the bad part. How about you suggest the idea to him in a way that will make it impossible for him to say no. I have a very good friend who does this. For my part, since most of my friends are similar, I try to make a habit of going, hey, do you want advice here, or are you just venting?. She may ask you to pass her her bag or move around you to get her bag. I'll check it and issue an invitation to you when it's convenient for me to host you. (For values of we meaning the people of my generation that I know. If someone is discussing a plan in front of you, they know youre there! Likewise that does come across as very clingy and needy to me. People have different friend relationships, different notions of what is appropriate at work, and different touch boundaries. If its going to be a regularly scheduled thing, then either setting up a scheduled hang out, or just giving me a heads up that this is a thing that is happening and that you would like to hang out is better. I stopped hanging out with them for several reasons, but this was a main one. In general, if a group seems genuinely cliquey, then think twice about inviting yourself along to something they're doing. Generally, with close friends, I do the text and make plans like now approach. I dont think Id send the same sort of can I drop in? text to, say, a coworker or someone who I wasnt cool being kind of disheveled around. What if it rains, or snows, or if its swelteringly hot outside? Re: Purple0 (sorry nesting fail) I told her that she needs to call before visiting and she basically said if she did that either mom or myself would say no, so shes just going to continue showing up. If its someone I havent seen in a while who is finally back in town and a surprise its both good and bad. You know this, Im sure, but do not invite yourself to this gathering. . I also have this insecurity that most people dont really like hanging out with me, so deep down, Im kind of concerned that they mightve changed the plans and forgotten about me when they let everyone know OR that they changed their mind about hanging out with me but havent come up with a graceful way of canceling. I say invite T.! PLEASE CALL ME. Is it the same rule? Ill text before I leave home so that I know if theres any point in leaving on time or if I should aim to be late like they will probably be. For example if Bob Alice Camille Davy et al all know that Bob and Gerry are going on their honeymoon starting on Friday, I will feel fine talking about the picnic on Saturday. It hasnt worked as well for me though. I didn't mean for it to come across as an invitation. If I dont know someone is comming the floor will probably be under a few layers of clothes and I might be unable to socialize at the moment, even if I would have loved to hang out if I had gotten time to mentaly prepare for it. Also, I dont really agree that there was a certain time when these things were normal and now its all changed.. Does anyone else feel really weird even discussing plans with someone if you arent inviting them to join you? Part of the home visit dread in my life is the potential endlessness of it. More like quasi-grudging, quasi-cheerful wellp, this is what society expects houses to be cleaned like, so Im getting there slowly stuff. I have had folks invite themselves over the same day and I have wangled it into lets meet at the bar rather than shame-cleaning or not being able to kick them out when I am sleepy, if its someone you feel you cannot say no to (but just know you can always say no). The mildly annoying scenario would call for asking him to amuse himself while I finished whatever I was in the middle of. Be confident and approach the situation with success in mind. Feeling confident in the friendship, and not thinking about the possibility that people can like you bunches. The easiest way to get a guy to invite you over is to suggest the idea to him in a way that will make it nearly impossible for him to say no. It imposes too much on the person who lives there. That creeping hot flush, the rock in the pit of your belly, and the sting from holding back tears. Also don't give a room a complete makeover without gaining permission to do so first. Here's when we do it. I think its one of those relics of when a Good Woman didnt go out much during the day and/or when basically everyone was on the same schedule(or when people lived in a small town and if you werent working in some way you were at home. In college, in dorms or group housing situations in the early 1990s, friends were like vampires: Invite them in once and then they werepretty free to come and go, and there would always be that one person who doesnt pay rent but is nonetheless always around. Hey, these new gaslights I bought, arent they great?. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. I mean, if someone said I was driving by but didnt want to drop by in case it was rude (or even if you said I saw you driving by, why didnt you say hello? and they said that was the reason) then you could reassure them that youd be happy for them to come by any time. I personally would lean toward expecting people at least 5-10 minutes early or late and talk to them if they go beyond that and its a problem. Lets say you were completely wrong when you showed off your new bicycle, and lets say your friend told you so. Id rather get a text than have them come down the steep staircase to get me, or have to keep running up those stairs to see if theyve arrived. ), This doesnt mean it cant be okay in specific workplaces, or with specific people! The thing that you are missing, it sounds very much like you miss it from a privileged position of not having safe-space related anxiety. Like, most of Mr Birds family lives in Nearish Smaller Town, and often have to come to Big Town where we live for shopping, doctors, etc. Suddenly I was walking on eggshells around her afraid I was going to violate some new rule shed just decreed. Its work, which is a coworkers and customers and me place, and unless the friends also happen to fit into one of those categories I dont want to see them. It is completely ok to ask if other halves/thirds/whatevers are invited, but PLEASE be gracious about hearing no. Let them know! I want to hang out, but Im not psychic! This is about my comfort in my own home and has nothing to do with catering to guests, or being proper or mannerly. I wish Id done that when this happened to me. I never got why it was so important why I had to end my visits to their place at a certain time, but I mostly went along with it. LW says they considered this person their *best friend. That theres no polite way for me to say Welp, Ive had enough talking, I need you to leave so I can take off my pants and binge watch Steven Universe for an hour before bed. I second the excellent advice and on a side note, that movie is hilarious. Moreover, I think its self-absorbed to assume that your social acquaintance/friend that wasnt invited to a thing particularly wants to hear all about how much fun you had without them doing whatever thing it was you were doing. I dont know if it was the same kind of thing for you, but my father and stepmother were always doing the Im going to ask you what sounds like a question but it really isnt and then shame you for failing to have manners I havent actually taught you and oh what an embarrassing child you are game. An unannounced home-visit, however, doesnt have a built-in time limit, and this might be part of the reason she is not open to them. I have a sister-in-law with family like this. All of it. It works pretty well . Every so often there is a shitty parent who doesnt care if your kids like each other (because they dont like you or your kid for some stupid reason), but I think you get maybe four asks, versus adult arrangements. This was actually THE reason we didnt end up dating. Britney: No, WERE (gestures back and forth between me and her) going out. but where will the implications sit if youve moved all of the furniture? You are invited to the birthday party of my sweet little baby who is turning one on coming Sunday. Ill have discomfort discussing a plan with a person if its a plan that they could conceivably have been involved with. People who drop by are unlikely to find me conscious or appropriately dressed. And I dont want to raise expectations falsely and unsustainably. Mind if I come along? Does it matter that T did come to my sons birthday party (not at our house) last week? And I never, never drop by someone elses house without warning! Ugh, yes. Seriously. I live alone, so I dont make the baked treats I like to make because I would eat them all. If I get stuck in that sort of discussion with the same person more than a few times, I tend to check out on my investment in the relationship, because meh. I care a *lot*, because having my mother constantly belittle me, my housekeeping skills and my space whenever she visits makes my home feel not like a safe space. (My friend is a really good person and as close to a sibling as Ive got outside my actual family. Intimacy and connection with other people means putting yourself out there, taking risks, and sometimes making mistakes. I wouldn't say it's rude but it's possible that people feel uncomfortable then. Its just no longer prudent to do so, unfortunately. Obviously I am not the friend LW is referencing here, but having a friend of mine ask me if they could drop by for a hug while I was at work on a regular basis would be an issue. (Never again!). Gah. 4. Nobody dropped by after about 8pm without prior arrangement because the children were in bed there were rules. My ideal is a phone call from a passenger as the driver gets close, or a phone call by the driver from the loading zone. I put out little soaps shaped like sea shells and sometimes buy flowers or light a scented candle. Oh god. Seriously, my go-to method is to hide out of sight and pretend Im not in until they give up and go away. I mean if its my sister, then she can drop by anytime because if I was going to take a nap I will just say hey, I was about to take a nap, you know where the coffee, internet, tv remote is, see you in 45 minutes. Same here. In-laws decided to visit. Be cool and become the person that everyone wants to have over. Regardless your friend is letting you know shes not cool with it, which means you need to stop doing it to her specifically. Im an extreme introvert and wouldnt want people dropping in on me either, but if it had been my boyfriend, I wouldnt have minded. And if its someone who Im far enough from intimate with that I need to clean up and make some kind of snack to offer, then that requires more notice. I dont have guests for the same reason I dont have Facebook- I just cant do that and keep any semblance of mental equilibrium. So when I want to go hang out with him Ill message him (skype, steam, facebook, or text) and say hey is x date/time ok for me to come over and we can watch really amusing horror movies (we find scary stuff to be very entertaining). Then if the friend wants to, she can suggest you come to her house but if shes not up for that, she can decline altogether or agree to meet up elsewhere without feeling like she was put on the spot. Re: can you actually trust people to say what they meanI wish you could, but sometimes, as we all know, you cant. Or maybe I just had other plans for the next hour and now Im going to be behind on the day. Additional awkwardness if I have company already and didnt invite the drop-inner. And, in fact, I will go out of my way NOT to do things she does not use her words to ask me to do before assigning chores or duties to me. Newly married. I think this is one of those areas that is super frustrating because there is just not a clear rule. I dont mind drop-ins, if its just a rare opportunity thing like they were down the street running an errand. Ive decided that the purpose of my houses mess is to make other people feel comfortable about their own houses mess. For example, my friend M, told me about a cultural quirk where he grew up in Brazil. I have a completely different set of habits, displayed personality traits, etc. A soft no is still a no. HOWEVER. *Maybe* they came in super quick to pee because they were on a long hike across the neighborhood, but that was it. Anything less clear than that (ME: What are you doing after kickball? / THEM: Were going to the Pun-Off!), and I assume that I am not invited. The enthusiastic feeling that the Christmas holidays bring is irreplaceable. I dont mind close friends stopping by, especially if they call/text/email first to let me know theyre in the area. Sorry my place is so messy. I dont mind. It would be really rude to say fuck yeah its disgusting. If the issue is that youre using that as a soft no and people are ignoring your soft no by saying its fine, thats a problem for a different reason and those people could use the captains advice above about listening for soft nos when they invite themselves over. You'll make your life much simpler. I felt like this was sort of a default thing that everyone did until I met a friend of a friend and we became semi-close. Showed off your new bicycle, and different touch boundaries in Brazil crap and books and papers and.... On coming Sunday ) incompatible in certain ways while who is finally back in town and a surprise both. The enthusiastic feeling that the purpose of my houses mess told you so where I grew there. Until they give up and go away not psychic what is appropriate at,... Vs. her inviting you, they were down the street running an errand visit dread in my life the... For asking him to amuse himself while I finished whatever I was going to be behind on the that... 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